This is an update to an earlier post found here. I used this post for information on Southampton contracts. However, I will repeat some material from that post so that this post will stand on its own.
The primary difference between European rosters and Premier League rosters is that the Premier League does not currently distinguish among the types of home grown players. We are required to have eight home grown players on our roster or we have to leave empty roster spots. In Europe, eight home grown players are also required but at least four of them have to be trained at the club. Unlike last summer where only Isgrove was club, this year we have five potential club trained players—at least one of whom, Ward-Prowse—is likely to be useful.
Each club is required to submit two different European
roster lists at each registration deadline.
The registration deadlines occur immediately prior to each
qualification/playoff round, the group stage, and the knock out stage. There are limitations on registering players
who have already played for someone else in the same competition during the
same season, but those limits do not matter right now.
The “B” list is the easier to explain. A player is eligible to be place on
Southampton’s “B” list if they were born on or after 1 January 1995 and were
eligible to play for Southampton for any two uninterrupted years since their
15th birthday. If they are 16, then need
to have been registered with Southampton for the last two years. There is no limit to the number of players
who can be registered on the B list.
I went through the official Southampton FC website (and
other sources) and came up with a list of B list eligible players for next
season. I have listed only those players
currently with the club who have signed professional contracts. This does not mean that players without pro
contracts are not eligible—just that they are unlikely to be significant enough
to our plans for the coming season to worry about.
Southampton can register up to 25 players on the A
list. However, at least eight players
must be “locally trained” and at least four of those players must be
“club-trained.” The other four can be
“association-trained.
“Club-trained” players are ones who have been registered
with Southampton for three full seasons between ages 15 and 21. The seasons can include the ones where the
player turns 15 or 21. Unlike last year
when Southampton had only one club trained player, we now have five. Only Ward-Prowse has seen significant playing
time, but, if we qualify for Europe, I would expect three of the other four to
be with the club next season unless they are viewed as literally being worse that
nothing.
An “association-trained” player is one who has been
registered with one or more clubs from the same association for three seasons
or 36 months between the ages of 15 and 21.
Obviously, all club-trained players are also association-trained players
for the nation in which the club is registered.
If a club does not have enough club-trained or association-trained
players, it must leave the roster spots empty.
That is why we entered Europe last year with three empty roster spots.
The following is a list of current Southampton players
sorted into their appropriate European categories for the 2016-2017 season.
EUROPEAN SQUAD
LIST (AS OF 11/7/16)
A
LIST
B-List Other Association
Trained Club
Trained
Bakary* Clasie Austin Gape
Barnes Fonte Bertrand Isgrove
Barnes Fonte Bertrand Isgrove
Cook Gardos Davis Stephens
Debayo Gazzaniga Forster Turnbull
Flannigan Hojbjerg** Lewis*** Ward-Prowse
Gallagher Martina Long
Hesketh Romeu Redmond
Johnson Soares Rodriguez
Jones TadicLittle Valery****
McCarthy Van Dijk
McQueen Yoshida
Mugabi
Olamola
Olamola
Reed
Seager
Sims
Slattery
Targett
Willard
Wood
*Bakary arrived at Southampton in April 2014. He is not English and I cannot determine when
first arrived in England, but assuming it was before August 2013, he would
count as association trained in England.
He becomes club trained for Southampton in April 2017—so not this
season.
** Hojbjerg would young enough for the B List this season,
but has not been with the club long enough so he will never be eligible for the
B list.
***Lewis arrived in the summer of 2015 so he becomes club trained in 2018 and B list eligible in 2017.
***Lewis arrived in the summer of 2015 so he becomes club trained in 2018 and B list eligible in 2017.
****Valery is French and arrived at Southampton in the
Summer of 2015 so he will not be club trained until summer of 2018. He will not be eligible for the B list until
the Summer of 2017. One suspects he will
not be playing European Football for us this season.
If we just focus on the A list after eliminating those
players who are obviously not going to be on the A list, this is what things
look like.
EUROPEAN SQUAD A
LIST (AS OF 11/7/16)
Other Association
Trained Club
Trained
Clasie Austin Gape
Fonte Bertrand Isgrove
Gardos Davis Stephens
Gazzaniga Forster Turnbull
Hojbjerg Long Ward-Prowse
Martina Redmond
Romeu Rodriguez
Soares
Tadic
Van Dijk
Yoshia
Yoshia
That is a total of 23 players with all required home grown
slots covered. In fact, we have five
people assigned to the club trained category which is one more than we are
likely to use. This means we have room
for three more players who can be of any nationality. Give that we have to play somewhere between 46
and 68 matches, it would be crazy to go into the season understaffed by three
players. (And this doesn’t even account
for the potential demands imposed by the new EFL trophy competition.)
PREMIER LEAGUE SQUAD LIST (AS OF 11/7/16)
Home Grown Other
Austin Clasie
Bertrand Fonte
Davis Gardos
Forster Gazzaniga
Gape Martina
Isgrove Romeu
Long Soares
Redmond Tadic
Rodriguez Van
Dijk
Stephens Yoshida
Turnbull
Ward-Prowse
Thus, for Premier League purposes, we have twelve home grown
players and 10 other players for a total of 22 players who would have to be
registered on the 25 man Premier League roster in order to be eligible to
play. (Hojbjerg is an under-21 player
for Premier League purposes and does not count against the squad limit.) Obviously, we have more flexibility than that
because it is unlikely all four of Gape, Turnbull, Stephens, and Isgrove are in
our plans for this season. On the other
hand, we could put all four of them on the Premier League squad but leave one
off the Europa squad and then buy three more players who would be eligible for
both competitions. Or would could leave
all four of them off the Premier League squad and include three of them on the
Europa squad. That would give us
openings for seven more players, four of whom could not play in the Europa
League.
I will assume that we are going to have the same roster for both
competitions—aside from the extra Premier League slot created by Hojbjerg’s
age. This means we need three more
players who need not be home grown. Ignoring
the four younger club trained players, this is how we stand by positions:
GK: 2
LB 2
CB 4
RB 2
DM 3 (4 if we
count Reed)
CM 2
AM/S 5
There is some arbitrariness to where I categorized players. I put Davis and Ward-Prowse into the CM
category but Redmond and Tadic into the AM/S category.
WHAT DO WE NEED
Aside from Goalkeeper, we don’t look like we are
particularly short in any position, but more depth is necessary given the games
that will need to be played. In the
following discussion I use the players’ ages as of 1 July 2016.
GOALKEEPERS
Obviously, we need another backup goalkeeper. We cannot go into a Premier League season
with only one. In my
February post I said that it was time to sign Forster to a long term
contract. That was done but we still
have a problem. I am willing to assume
the club views Gazzaniga as a satisfactory backup. Is an under-21 goal keeper a good enough back
up for him? I doubt it, but I don’t know
who would be willing to sign to be our third goalkeeper. In a strange way, the injury to Forster
helped last year because it meant we could get a quality third goalkeeper for
the season.
DEFENDERS
It is not clear that we are strong enough at right back. Supposedly we are looking at Jeremy Pied for
this position.
Back in February I said that we needed to strengthen at
center back unless Stephens was ready or we were sure about Gardos. Nothing that has happened since changes my view. It would be crazy to assume Fonte is not
doing to start dropping in quality due to his age (and the lack of a summer
break). Gardos was undoubtedly signed
thinking he would be good enough to start for us. Maybe he is, but with all his injuries there
is simply no way to know. The younger
home grown center backs do not seemed to have progressed to the point where
they can be counted on, but with the new manager and the supposed increased
focus on youth development, maybe the plan is to give them a chance this
season.
Nevertheless, I would try to sign a high quality young
center back and let him know that he would get a chance to compete for a
starting job and, in any case, squad rotation would mean that he would get 10 to
20 starts depending on how far we progress in the various competitions.
Left back appears to be in fine shape.
MIDFIELD
We seem to be set in the midfield. We probably will not have anyone as good as
Wanyama on one of his good days, but we probably will not have anyone who
passes as poorly as he does on his bad days.
That being said Romeu is something of a problem. He is 24 but he was only signed to a three
year contract. Unless the plan is to use
him for three years and let him leave on a free, his contract needs to be
extended this summer. If he doesn’t want
to resign, better to find that out now and takes steps to replace him.
Steven Davis is also a potential problem because he 31—old
by midfielder standards. He was signed
to a contract extension which means that he is scheduled to be here until age
34. He is, perhaps, more likely to start
fading now than Fonte since he has to run around so much more. I have to assume
the club has decided that he is worth the risk and that they will deal with any
aging issues by playing him less.
ATTACKERS
This is the biggest changed area since my last post. We have lost three players here (not counting
Rameriz) but have only signed one replacement.
I guess the club considers Austin to be a replacement
signing since he was signed in contemplation of Pelle leaving this summer. He is signed until 2020 when he will be 30. His fitness situation is also uncertain. That suggests that someone else might be
needed.
After last season, the club appears to intend to rely on
Long as the primary striker. However, he
is 29 and only has two years left on his relatively high wage contract. It seems unlikely that he would be signed to
a long contract extension. A shorter
extension might be a good idea but I don’t know that it would make sense for Long
to sign one. (Long might be headed for
Major League Soccer at some point. He
would be a perfect player for MLS if he can retain most of his pace and
endurance.) As it is, Long’s contract
expires when he is 31. He will likely be
showing some effects of aging by then.
Rodriguez is also a question mark. We do not know whether he will be good
enough.
Tadic is 27 years old and his contract expires in 2018. I would think the club would want to resign
him. Perhaps he doesn’t want to sign a
new contract but if that is the case he is worth a lot more if sold this year
than next.
Redmond is 22 and signed through 2021. We will just have to see how he turns out,
but clearly the club is counting on him heavily this year. I don’t think it is reasonable to view him as
Mane’s replacement but maybe that is what he is. I liked it better when I thought we might see
both of them on the field at the same time.
WHAT DO WE NEED?
If February I listed our needs thusly:
A back up goal keeper NOT
YET DONE
A centerback who is better than Yoshida and younger than
Fonte NOT YET DONE
A right back who can challenge Soares for playing time NOT YET DONE (unless Martina now qualifies)
A midfielder who can take over Steven Davis’ role and an
extension to Romeu’s or Wanyama’s contract (or both) PARTIALLY DONE BECAUSE HOJBJERG MAY QUALIFY
A replacement for Pelle and Mane—if they are not going to
stay for another year NOT YET DONE
An attacking winger DONE
From my February perspective, the club still has a lot of
work to do. On the other hand, I don’t
really feel like the team is that far off where it needs to be to compete. However, if we want to qualify for the
Champions League we are not there. That
being said, other than at goalkeeper I think it would be a mistake to buy
anyone who cannot improve the starting 11—or at least might be able to do so. We have room for four players and we need to
fill all those slots.
